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Since I served on Park and Rec when the Oak Woodland was approved, I'll be waiting for the oak trees to provide me shade when I'm 90. I'm just saying. I didn't expect a 5 gallon pot to be planted. Dolan: The City Engineer often refers to a saying attributed to Confucius: "He who plants a tree does not enjoy the shade." Commissioner Balch: You've become a smooth stone, my friend. So to that end, I would argue that your square footages should be strongly looked at. I know the concept of what you're trying to do. You're trying to look at what your needs are, your anticipated growth and your square footage, and we all know that to redo or remodel is going to be three times the cost of doing it larger at the beginning. I mean, I know that well. So, City Hall at 40,000- square -feet, which is probably the only one I kind of have a feeling for. I know that the OSC wasn't considered in this when you guys did the move plans. You're talking about your five buildings here and not the OSC operations, but you know, you and I served on the East Side and we talked about the moving of the OSC. I know that they have space needs, so I just would encourage that if you wanted to make it a 50 or 60 year building, that this be a consideration if you do have enough. And, I think your concept of movability, scalability or flexibility of the design is important. And my last comment I'll just say is that a lot of cities I've been to —the City of San Jose, City of Milpitas, City of Tracy had built brand new city halls. And I'll tell you what, you should go look at them now. Some of them look like they could use a little bit of paint and sprucing up. One that is nine stories tall for example that is south of us, the planning department is hard to get to, hard to utilize. They made it where you have a great grand space that echoes so you cannot hear a planner across the table. There are some things we could lose about the quaintness of our city if we try to be grandiose or illusion to grandeur. So, I would just caution us to be wise about that. And while I know natural light has happened, I also know when natural light can cause a person not to be able to use their desk because it's so hot because they haven't tinted the windows. That's all further down and I understand that, but I have seen good design lose out to practical reality in those cities —some have done better than others. I'll just say those three in particular. Commissioner O'Connor: I also wasn't thrilled initially about hearing that we were going to take up our central parkland with City Hall, but little by little I became more accustomed to it and I think you said it well tonight, someone did, about bringing the people from the park so close to City Hall. It's going to beg some kind of interaction whereas today, I think we are removed. Even though we're next to downtown, there aren't a lot of people who come to City Hall to these buildings unless they have business right here. This is going to bring a lot more people around City Hall. So, I have warmed up to it considerably. The parking structure though, definitely needs a third level. I mean, like you said, if you park on the roof, it doesn't take that much extra room up there. You have to go at least a third. I'm not real thrilled with all the parking that I think I've seen along the second access road. There's no dimensions here so I'm not really sure if it's drawn to scale. I think the people backing out of those parking places are going to make this not quite a second access route. It's going to be hard getting in and out of there with cars passing PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES, September 28, 2016 Page 7 of 32